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drummara / percusarra


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#1 ShawnPhase

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Posted 04 July 2009 - 11:22 AM

yeah, donno why we never got this started but here goes. i am here to give help and answer questions for drummers and for drum programmers as far as tips and tricks, progress hints, makes and models, and any discussion therein about the things we hit. doesnt even matter if its a drum, i could give a fuck less. as long as you use it in a percussive manner and it achieves a tone, thats worthwhile discussion to me.

the first thing i wanted to share in this thread is a video of me creating natural feedback with my rototom using the edge of the cymbal and my thumb. the hum you hear is coming from the rototom, and its very loud, you can ask kirby or house, they saw it as well.
click to see (turn the volume on your computer up a bit to really hear it, the video isnt that great)

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my drums and drumming style over the years has changed and adapted very drastically. i have gone from what i felt was applicable as a good drummer and became closer to what i feel a drummer should be, an extention of rythym that speaks through the melody and harmony of the song, but without saying too much. with any good drummer, you know your limitations, and what you are capable of utilizing to its max potential without gimmicking any one piece. i could add a gong of some type and still use it tastefully. that would be a good step for live applications, but im not holding my breath for paiste to drop a huge talisman in my lap unless someone can point them at me. at least not at this point. i still have lots to learn. but the things that i have come to aggregate in my kit, and use on a normal basis, are the things that i have learned not only defined me as a drummer in the past, but also gave new reasons for me to learn and explore newer ways to earn an ambidextrous mindset simply to be able to approach the drums in a manner that i feel is exceptional and respectful to the instruments themselves.

i would now like to open up the discussion to any and all of you. this thread is made mainly because ive had some good drum talk in pm here recently, so give it a go. i dont even care if you want to bitch about dfh any version or anything like that. lets get to the impetus of what makes drums drums and learn a thing or two while we're doin it, hehe.
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#2 TETSUOOOO!!!

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Posted 04 July 2009 - 11:52 AM

I need to brush up on my techniques and get some rudimentary lessons again. Before I started playing, my mom bought me a remo drumpad and that's when I started taking lessons from my neighbor. He helped me excel with paradiddles, flamadiddles, double-strokes, triplets, and putting emphasis on certain notes. This helped me develop technique before I actually started playing on a set; it was incredible how fast I progressed on the drums.

Lately, I've been struggling with dynamics in terms of playing too aggressively or too gently. Typically, I'm a gentle player, but lately I've been forcing myself to play more aggressively. I don't tense up as much as I used to while playing aggressively, and I'm starting to feel a groove with the dynamic, so I'll continue to adapt in that way.

What are your opinions on the dynamics of "gentle playing" versus "aggressive playing", or combining the two depending on the mode?

Another things: Ergonamics! This is very important with any instrument! My teacher taught this to me, but not thoroughly. He was very specific about how the snare should be positioned (little above your knees while sitting; not-too-flat, not-too-angled where the head is facing you too much). I'm still learning what's most comfortable for me while playing, but right now it feels pretty good. I'm having a problem with the placement of one of my cymbals. It's a zilbell elevated slightly lower than, and in the middle of, two of my crashes. I'm pretty sure I'm better off not having the zilbell there, but I'm so stubborn about already accustomed to it being there. I think I'll be taking it off and maybe piggybacking or finding another individual space for it.
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#3 pingosimon

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Posted 04 July 2009 - 12:00 PM

What are your opinions on the dynamics of "gentle playing" versus "aggressive playing", or combining the two depending on the mode?

This is something I think a lot of drummers need to learn. If you have to pick one, I say go with gentler, unless the only type of shows you're playing are gigantic venues.

I think every show I go to where the sound sucks, a lot of the reason is the drummer just "can't" (won't) play more quietly. Maybe at an outdoor event with a great sound system for the other instruments, this is fine, but for bar shows and the like, the mix won't sound good if the drummer is at full volume. The sound guy will have to try to turn up everything else, and guitar leads won't cut through, etc.

I'm so glad all the drummers I work with right now are good about this.
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#4 Guest_Repo Man_*

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Posted 04 July 2009 - 12:04 PM

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#5 TETSUOOOO!!!

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Posted 04 July 2009 - 12:19 PM

What are your opinions on the dynamics of "gentle playing" versus "aggressive playing", or combining the two depending on the mode?

This is something I think a lot of drummers need to learn. If you have to pick one, I say go with gentler, unless the only type of shows you're playing are gigantic venues.

I think every show I go to where the sound sucks, a lot of the reason is the drummer just "can't" (won't) play more quietly. Maybe at an outdoor event with a great sound system for the other instruments, this is fine, but for bar shows and the like, the mix won't sound good if the drummer is at full volume. The sound guy will have to try to turn up everything else, and guitar leads won't cut through, etc.

I'm so glad all the drummers I work with right now are good about this.


I do prefer playing more gently because my tension decreases dramatically. I noticed that the more gentle I play, the more range my dynamics have, which is required if I want to play effectively in any fusion bands.

I was in a band for a couple of months that demanded of me to play VERY AGGRESSIVELY. I was the newest addition, so I wasn't going to contest with them about it, so I gave it a try. I never felt comfortable playing through the sets. During our first gig, the aggressive playing they demanded resulted in popped blood blisters that made a horrendous mess. It was kind of cool, but it certainly did affect my playing adversely. I had to play more intensely anyways because the other members insisted on playing loud, loud, LOUD. That band annoyed me so bad, I'm surprised I stayed in the band as long as I did.
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#6 Guest_Repo Man_*

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Posted 04 July 2009 - 12:22 PM

What are your opinions on the dynamics of "gentle playing" versus "aggressive playing", or combining the two depending on the mode?

This is something I think a lot of drummers need to learn. If you have to pick one, I say go with gentler, unless the only type of shows you're playing are gigantic venues.

I think every show I go to where the sound sucks, a lot of the reason is the drummer just "can't" (won't) play more quietly. Maybe at an outdoor event with a great sound system for the other instruments, this is fine, but for bar shows and the like, the mix won't sound good if the drummer is at full volume. The sound guy will have to try to turn up everything else, and guitar leads won't cut through, etc.

I'm so glad all the drummers I work with right now are good about this.


im not good about this. i like to play loud with a lot of energy. i would rather play an energetic show with armature fills and some mess ups. then play quited but meticulous and perfect.
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#7 pingosimon

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Posted 04 July 2009 - 12:26 PM

Yeah, I'm talking about balance. I agree with you on having fun vs being perfect, but I'd sacrifice drum volume/energy for the ability to hear the other instruments in a band.
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#8 Ranger-X

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Posted 04 July 2009 - 12:28 PM

So here's a question for all you drummer dudes out there. I love playing drums, but I can't play for more than 30 minutes or so before my thumb starts to cramp up on my right hand (I'm right handed and most of the heavy hits are made with that hand). Any suggestions on techniques for holding the stick? I'll try and take some pics / vids of how I hold them now so you can get a better idea...I'm sure the cramps are related to holding the stick too tight, but if I don't hold it that tight then I find it's hard to hit hard or do flutters...
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#9 Guest_Repo Man_*

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Posted 04 July 2009 - 12:36 PM

So here's a question for all you drummer dudes out there. I love playing drums, but I can't play for more than 30 minutes or so before my thumb starts to cramp up on my right hand (I'm right handed and most of the heavy hits are made with that hand). Any suggestions on techniques for holding the stick? I'll try and take some pics / vids of how I hold them now so you can get a better idea...I'm sure the cramps are related to holding the stick too tight, but if I don't hold it that tight then I find it's hard to hit hard or do flutters...

practice.. after a few months of daily practice you should be well.
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#10 pingosimon

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Posted 04 July 2009 - 12:39 PM

practice correctly.

FIX'D

I'll let the drummers tell you what "correctly" means, but whatever habit you need to break, you reallly need to stick with breaking it. Start out slow enough, and just concentrate on your grip or whatever. THen work that into actually playing, taking constant small breaks to ask yourself if you're doing it rigth.
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#11 TETSUOOOO!!!

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Posted 04 July 2009 - 12:43 PM

So here's a question for all you drummer dudes out there. I love playing drums, but I can't play for more than 30 minutes or so before my thumb starts to cramp up on my right hand (I'm right handed and most of the heavy hits are made with that hand). Any suggestions on techniques for holding the stick? I'll try and take some pics / vids of how I hold them now so you can get a better idea...I'm sure the cramps are related to holding the stick too tight, but if I don't hold it that tight then I find it's hard to hit hard or do flutters...


Hmmm, sounds like you might be overcompensating with your thumb. What I do is I pivot the stick in between my index (the proximal region) and my thumb (positioned on the part of the stick facing you). Try not to grip your sticks with your thumb and index tightly or else that will result in stiffening of the joints. Try relying more with your outside palm and pinky for an easy grip to help the pivotal balance - this doesn't have to be perfect, but it's a great guideline to use. Also don't give so much work to your wrists; use your arms to your advantage and distribute the work amongst your arm, wrist and hand of each stroke evenly.

I hope that helps! Trust me, I still have to reinforce myself with reproach on stick-technique.

:D
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#12 ShawnPhase

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Posted 04 July 2009 - 04:19 PM

there are two main things that will help with gentler aggro playing, and i think im the master of it. getting sticks that fit your hands perfectly, and stregnthening your wrists. these are things that you hands down have got to do. practice with warmups, rudiments, as long as you can keep barrel rolling, keep going. if your hand cramps, go thru the cramp. thats a good thing, because it means you havent done it before and as long as you dont repeat doing it, you'll start growth from there. sometimes its good to try 20 and 20, 20 minutes of practicing, 20 of rest. im of the opinion thats the way to do, and do it in threes. so if you have 2 hours to devote to disciplining yourself, the best to start with is your three stroke and four stroke rolls. start from very quiet to very loud to very quiet again and you'll feel the difference in your wrists and forearms. i'll discuss different stick sizes sooner rather than later.
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#13 thebeautyofgrind

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Posted 29 August 2009 - 09:38 PM

I bought new cymbals today. next thing to get is a rack/cage.

6" zil-bel
14" mini china
17" A Custom crash
18" Z Custom Medium crash
18" China Trash

I already have:

14" A Custom hats
16" Crash
20" Z Custom ride
9.5" Zil-Bel (yup, now I have BOTH!)


when I'm all said and done with it, I'll post a pic (if I remember) It's a Pearl EX 7 piece. 2 Bass Drums, 2 mounted toms, 2 floors, snare (I actually have 2, as a backup)
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http://www.thebeauty...d.bandcamp.com/

 

"sausage biscuit"?? ok i'm outta here (closing menu, leaving)


#14 weener

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Posted 29 August 2009 - 11:24 PM

Really, this thread should have been called, "baterķa."
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 "This thing is vibrating like a $50 milkshake!"


#15 Josiah Tobin

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Posted 30 August 2009 - 12:16 AM

doesnt even matter if its a drum, i could give a fuck less. as long as you use it in a percussive manner and it achieves a tone, thats worthwhile discussion to me.

My computer chair right now is this minimalistic white metal stool, just a flat round top with two U-shaped bars crossed under it to make four legs. I noticed that you can play it kind of like a djembe, whacking your thumb near the rim creates a really badass industrial 'PONGGG' kinda sound, sorta like Lars Ulrich's Stanger snare except it actually sounds cool in a lot of ways. Using this thing as percussion on the upcoming Swimfail album "Vermin," it's real fun to play with honestly.

~josiah
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