Jump to content


Photo

Donald Trump Is Your New President.


4268 replies to this topic

#4141 Cursed Lemon

Cursed Lemon

    Rauble Rauble

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 901 posts
  • Location:The Corpse of the Motor City

Posted 21 August 2019 - 08:04 AM

One, I have no idea why you took offense to that, and two, it's exactly why I don't talk about politics (aside from shitting on Trump) on Facebook because of my many hard-left friends who will come at me with exactly that kind of leftist-rabbit-hole criticism. 

 

You can tell me I'm wrong, but you'd be wrong. 


  • 0

#4142 Robby V

Robby V

    Shizz Master Zero

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 7,084 posts

Posted 21 August 2019 - 08:11 AM

I didn’t take offense, I just thought your hypothetical seemed like hog wash considering any discussions I’ve seen in actual physical leftist spaces have had a very different and more nuanced take.
  • 0

eKawlATs.jpg


#4143 Cursed Lemon

Cursed Lemon

    Rauble Rauble

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 901 posts
  • Location:The Corpse of the Motor City

Posted 21 August 2019 - 08:12 AM

Well I've never been in a physical leftist space, so I wouldn't know on that front, but obviously people take far greater liberties with their tone on the internet. 


  • 0

#4144 Arm Cannon

Arm Cannon

    Shizz Master Zero

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 7,234 posts
  • Location:Bonerland

Posted 21 August 2019 - 08:36 AM

last week I got told by a couple conservative Texans that I was drinking with that I was the most well informed, reasonable liberal they’ve ever met

I told them: “Guys I’m not some liberal unicorn, in the spaces I operate in, I have dozens and dozens of liberal friends just as nuanced and perhaps better informed than I am. I am the norm.”
  • 0

#4145 Rize

Rize

    Shizz Gawd

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 11,254 posts
  • Location:Baton Rouge

Posted 21 August 2019 - 08:50 AM

none come to mind for me off the top of my head, id love to hear which ones you had in mind that youre trying to use to stir up discourse. all the major positions i can think of I agree with:

 

- gun control: absolute no brainer. we are the only fucking country in the world dealing with this. hardcore background checks. stop selling to domestic abusers. ban all assault rifles. im yet to see an example of a good guy with a gun stopping a bad guy.

 

- universal healthcare: studies and research have shown that this ends up being cheaper in the long run, and ya know, poor people actually have a chance to survive when they get sick. diabetes meds cost $2 to make and they charge $400 for it.

 

- free tuition/debt-forgiveness: this is the only one im not entirely decided on. free tuition definitely appears to be working in other countries in europe. at the very least it should absolutely be more controlled because its fucking insanely expensive and the job market for new grads is shit and mostly privileged white people are the only ones making it. some amount of debt needs to be forgiven because its a bubble thats going to tank the economy for the next generaiton. however, i dont know what to do re debt for like doctors who end up making 400k+ a year. yea they get stuck with tons of med school debt, but they can also pay it off in a matter of years instead of decades

 

- reparations: my understanding is that the huge wealth disparity that exists between POC and non-POC can still be traced all the way back to slavery and if we can spend trillions on the military every year than we can afford to give POC a chance at a fair existence.

 

- abolish ICE: yes. do it. now. fuck ICE. its never been about safety or due process. its about skin color and you cant even try to argue that its not. there's children dying in fucking cages.

 

- green new deal: what are you fucking simple? of course. every scientist on the planet agrees man-made climate change is real and this planet isnt gonna make it past 2040 at this rate. get it the fuck together or we are all so fucked. baby boomers dont care about it because they'll all be dead by then.

 

And my understanding is that most of you are poorly informed on most of these topics (while at the same time thinking you're very well informed, because that's how propaganda works).  It's not a coincidence that you all believe essentially the same things.


  • 0

#4146 raubhimself

raubhimself

    CHAOS SPECIALIST

  • Shizzadmin
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 35,469 posts
  • Location:Phoenix, AZ

Posted 21 August 2019 - 08:52 AM

What specifically is anyone here poorly informed on, and why?


  • 2
sanitize.deodorize.pulverize
MINIBOSSIES NEVAR SAY DIE!
Good-Evil.net
 

'the smuggest amongst us will always be the quickest to point out the most minor transgressions of others around them'- a quote i just made up and put quotes around to make it seem slightly fancier


#4147 mig50

mig50

    Shizz Overlord

  • Shizzified
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 17,179 posts

Posted 21 August 2019 - 09:10 AM

fuck you, rize.
  • 7
you mean you forgot cranberries too?

#4148 Guy In Rubber Suit

Guy In Rubber Suit

    Shizz Master Zero

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 6,528 posts
  • Location:Phoenix, AZ

Posted 21 August 2019 - 09:21 AM

This is a really good article that probably answers a lot about reparations. I'm completely in favor of reparations. It's sorely needed to actually recover from slavery with the theft of lives and wealth of African Americans. Even if your great great grandparents had nothing to do with slavery, we still utilize the institutions from slavery as well as feeling its effects in many ways.

https://www.theatlan...rations/361631/

And fuck off Rize, you intellectually dishonest chode.


  • 3

#4149 Rize

Rize

    Shizz Gawd

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 11,254 posts
  • Location:Baton Rouge

Posted 21 August 2019 - 09:24 AM

Have a nice day mig.
 

What specifically is anyone here poorly informed on, and why?

 
The more informed you think you are, the more deeply you're likely to be into a web of reinforcing propaganda.  Hasn't that basically been established with science by now?  Of course, everyone thinks it doesn't apply to themselves.  Let's try some low hanging fruit from Brodan.  For him gun control is a no-brainer.  He said "I'm yet to see an example of a good guy with a gun stopping a bad guy."  I mean, really?

 

 

There was a 2013 CDC study which includes stats on the defensive use of firearms (I'll let Forbes introduce it: https://www.forbes.c...s/#5196ccf8299a )

 

In particular, a 2013 study ordered by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) and conducted by The National Academies’ Institute of Medicine and National Research Council reported that, “Defensive use of guns by crime victims is a common occurrence”:

 
 

Here's a salient portion from the study:  https://www.nap.edu/...19/chapter/3#15
 

Defensive Use of Guns

Defensive use of guns by crime victims is a common occurrence, although the exact number remains disputed (Cook and Ludwig, 1996; Kleck, 2001a). Almost all national survey estimates indicate that defensive gun uses by victims are at least as common as offensive uses by criminals, with estimates of annual uses ranging from about 500,000 to more than 3 million (Kleck, 2001a), in the context of about 300,000 violent crimes involving firearms in 2008 (BJS, 2010). On the other hand, some scholars point to a radically lower estimate of only 108,000 annual defensive uses based on the National Crime Victimization Survey (Cook et al., 1997). The variation in these numbers remains a controversy in the field. The estimate of 3 million defensive uses per year is based on an extrapolation from a small number of responses taken from more than 19 national surveys. The former estimate of 108,000 is difficult to interpret because respondents were not asked specifically about defensive gun use.
A different issue is whether defensive uses of guns, however numerous or rare they may be, are effective in preventing injury to the gun-wielding crime victim. Studies that directly assessed the effect of actual defensive uses of guns (i.e., incidents in which a gun was “used” by the crime victim in the sense of attacking or threatening an offender) have found consistently lower injury rates among gun-using crime victims compared with victims who used other self-protective strategies (Kleck, 1988; Kleck and DeLone, 1993; Southwick, 2000; Tark and Kleck, 2004).

 

 

Now, if you can admit you were badly informed on this subject, just apply that to everything else you think you know and you'll be on to something.  If you're a truly independent thinker, your head should be full of a LOT of "I don't knows" and "maybes".


  • 1

#4150 raubhimself

raubhimself

    CHAOS SPECIALIST

  • Shizzadmin
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 35,469 posts
  • Location:Phoenix, AZ

Posted 21 August 2019 - 09:29 AM

Yes, the CDC has absolutely never acted with an agenda such as with marijuana usage and the NRA absolutely does not have its hands in the same politicians' pockets that prevent the CDC from doing real research on things like marijuana.

 

But your entire opinion of that study hinges on the idea that the only and/or best way to prevent crime is to arm the public.


  • 0
sanitize.deodorize.pulverize
MINIBOSSIES NEVAR SAY DIE!
Good-Evil.net
 

'the smuggest amongst us will always be the quickest to point out the most minor transgressions of others around them'- a quote i just made up and put quotes around to make it seem slightly fancier


#4151 Arm Cannon

Arm Cannon

    Shizz Master Zero

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 7,234 posts
  • Location:Bonerland

Posted 21 August 2019 - 09:29 AM

It turns out we only open our mouths when we’ve done the due diligence
  • 1

#4152 Cursed Lemon

Cursed Lemon

    Rauble Rauble

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 901 posts
  • Location:The Corpse of the Motor City

Posted 21 August 2019 - 09:35 AM

Wtf kind of rebuttal is that

 

When did anyone ever say "good guys with guns often get shot themselves" 

 

The answer is never


  • 1

#4153 Rize

Rize

    Shizz Gawd

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 11,254 posts
  • Location:Baton Rouge

Posted 21 August 2019 - 09:40 AM

Yes, the CDC has absolutely never acted with an agenda such as with marijuana usage and the NRA absolutely does not have its hands in the same politicians' pockets that prevent the CDC from doing real research on things like marijuana.

 
There's that web of reinforcing propaganda I mentioned.

 

But your entire opinion of that study hinges on the idea that the only and/or best way to prevent crime is to arm the public.


This is typical of leftists. You can envision a better way, so practical concerns be damned. Let's just ban all the guns and move on to the better way... meanwhile many people will literally die who otherwise wouldn't have while you work out the details of a policy that probably wouldn't even work.

 

 

 

 


Wtf kind of rebuttal is that
 
When did anyone ever say "good guys with guns often get shot themselves"
 
The answer is never

 

This reply doesn't make any sense in context.  I think you have misunderstood something I wrote or quoted.


  • 0

#4154 TV's Frink

TV's Frink

    Shizz Boss

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 8,208 posts

Posted 21 August 2019 - 09:44 AM

Expecting Rize to change is like expecting Donald Trump to change.
  • 2

#4155 Cursed Lemon

Cursed Lemon

    Rauble Rauble

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 901 posts
  • Location:The Corpse of the Motor City

Posted 21 August 2019 - 09:45 AM

This reply doesn't make any sense in context.  I think you have misunderstood something I wrote or quoted.


Yeah no I didn't.

The bolded section said that people who wielded guns avoided injury when falling victim to crime more often than those who didn't use guns.

Noooooooooooooooooooo shiiiiiiiiiiiitttttttttttttttttttt
  • 0



Reply to this topic



  


1 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 1 guests, 0 anonymous users