26 replies to this topic

[mothrock]

at least they have the balls to do this kind of thing there.

in USA we just take it lying down.

[azwestdevil72]

you guys are seriously saying 'we have to eat shit sandwiches, so they should too!'??

I'm saying higher education is a privelege and not a right. It would be nice if it were the other way around but it's not. It's not free. Somebody has to pay for it - either in tuition or tax subsidies. It's a shitty economy everywhere.

Tony, I agree. It's not that I like seeing tuition go up, but that is just reality. Higher education is expensive, and with a bad economy, it's getting moreso. It costs money to no only pay for running a university, the facilities, labs, computers, supplies, student support organizations, etc, but also the salaries of the faculty, and their support staff, and student workers and interns. Most state universities, including ASU, actually lose money for each student they educate, and rely on state funding and grants from the private sector to help recoup their losses. Tuition alone doesn't cut it, and in a down economy, state funding and grants dry up fast. Same thing is going on in the UK. The increases we have seen are simply to cover those rising costs. Students on both sides of the pond get a free education through high school as it is, and tacking on higher education simply is not feasible. Presumably, one gains a higher education to have a chance to earn more money than they otherwise would. Tuition is just an investment in yourself.

[fatguyaz]

you guys are seriously saying 'we have to eat shit sandwiches, so they should too!'??

I'm saying higher education is a privelege and not a right. It would be nice if it were the other way around but it's not. It's not free. Somebody has to pay for it - either in tuition or tax subsidies. It's a shitty economy everywhere.

Tony, I agree. It's not that I like seeing tuition go up, but that is just reality. Higher education is expensive, and with a bad economy, it's getting moreso. It costs money to no only pay for running a university, the facilities, labs, computers, supplies, student support organizations, etc, but also the salaries of the faculty, and their support staff, and student workers and interns. Most state universities, including ASU, actually lose money for each student they educate, and rely on state funding and grants from the private sector to help recoup their losses. Tuition alone doesn't cut it, and in a down economy, state funding and grants dry up fast. Same thing is going on in the UK. The increases we have seen are simply to cover those rising costs. Students on both sides of the pond get a free education through high school as it is, and tacking on higher education simply is not feasible. Presumably, one gains a higher education to have a chance to earn more money than they otherwise would. Tuition is just an investment in yourself.

well said.

[weener]

Community colleges seem to be able to give quality education cheaply. There's plenty of degrees you can get at universities that might as well be trade/certificate programs, because you don't really need all the cultural/global awareness courses that the university makes you take to graduate. I went to university, and most of the required classes were a waste of time. Do you really need to do that to get a degree in hotel/motel management, nutrition, parks management, or music therapy?

[Tony]

at least they have the balls to do this kind of thing there.

in USA we just take it lying down.

in soviet russia, tuition hikes protest YOU.

[Lt. Dizzle!]

now THAT'S how you protest! lol.

[jeremx]

Community colleges seem to be able to give quality education cheaply. There's plenty of degrees you can get at universities that might as well be trade/certificate programs, because you don't really need all the cultural/global awareness courses that the university makes you take to graduate. I went to university, and most of the required classes were a waste of time. Do you really need to do that to get a degree in hotel/motel management, nutrition, parks management, or music therapy?

yes. if you are not a well rounded person you will be a shit employee. that's just science.

[Tony]

Community colleges seem to be able to give quality education cheaply. There's plenty of degrees you can get at universities that might as well be trade/certificate programs, because you don't really need all the cultural/global awareness courses that the university makes you take to graduate. I went to university, and most of the required classes were a waste of time. Do you really need to do that to get a degree in hotel/motel management, nutrition, parks management, or music therapy?

yes. if you are not a well rounded person you will be a shit employee. that's just science.

i can't tell if you're joking or not.

there's a significant difference in getting a focused degree in something like music therapy and getting a bachelor of arts/science degree with a major in music therapy (i'm using music therapy as an example - i've never taken a music therapy class). in short, yeah, you're well rounded if you get the additional classes under your belt. employers look at the scope of your education and can use that to determine how adaptable you are to new topics and how easy it's going to be for you to learn. as far as the information itself, they probably don't give a shit if you understand the bolshevik revolution or the atmospheric properties of venus. but a LOT of big companies will hire people for a job because they had a college degree without regard to the actual major, because they know they're getting somebody who succeeded in a variety of subjects.

i happened to graduate with a degree in business, and my first job was with a very, very, large IT consulting firm. i was the only person in my hire class with a business background - everyone else was all over the map. psychology, math, marine biology, you name it. ultimately we were trained in computer programming (a field i studied very little of in school). we got hired because of our ability to do more than just whatever specialized training our degree gave us.

[jeremx]

i can't tell if you're joking or not.

i was.

it's my opinion that you'd be a better person and likely better employee the more well-rounded you are but it's not science. well, maybe it is. i'm not going to hit up google to look for studies.

[Jacki O.]

yeah my degree was in painting and now i work in forensics

in college i was all "oh man i am never gonna need to know this math stuff in the real world! geometry?!? fuck that! who does that?"

now i use geometry all the fucking time. i have to look shit up all the time on the internetz because i didnt pay attention in college.

[weener]

I paid attention in high school, and in college I had to waste my time with math and English classes that taught me nothing I didn't already know. I also learned way more in high school Spanish than I did when I took it in college, where it was "immersion" so I could barely understand what the teacher was assigning me, let alone new grammatical concepts.

[Tony]

I paid attention in high school, and in college I had to waste my time with math and English classes that taught me nothing I didn't already know. I also learned way more in high school Spanish than I did when I took it in college, where it was "immersion" so I could barely understand what the teacher was assigning me, let alone new grammatical concepts.

that could be a factor of the school you went to. or the fact that you're reasonably intelligent to begin with. i could see making an argument that art history is the kind of class you could do without (sorry, art historians). conversely, i would argue that math and english should be required for any type of degree.

every time i see somebody fuck up when it comes to basic math or english it makes me cringe. and i'm not talking about nitpicky stuff like not ending a sentence with a preposition - i'm talking about an inability to craft a coherent thought in writing. they lose all credibility with me. but i digress.

as an employer, i'd prefer the person who was capable of learning many subjects over the person with a myopic focus on one subject and a lack of knowledge on everything else. but hey, the world needs ditch diggers, too.

EDIT: it might look like i'm arguing both sides of the coin here since i basically told the UK kids to sack up and pay for school, and then 2 seconds later i'm talking about how important a college degree is. i agree with both of those statements. it's incredibly important, and it's not free. so if you feel like it's that important, then you should invest in yourself accordingly. and i don't completely disagree with weener either - i think associate degrees or specialized degrees are a worthy endeavor - but i think the overall experience and exposure of different topics in a university program is worthwhile even when you might be saying "there's no way i'm ever going to use this information in the real world." in conclusion, azwestdevil's earlier post succinctly described my feelings, and now i'm rambling.